Comments:

Kat, I post a message to my website www.lettersneversent.com. Not a plug (well, sorta), but it is a great way to get things off your chest. Try it, its theraputic. First time checking out your blog - will be back. Cheers!

By  Pete Czech, at 6:10 PM, January 26, 2006  

This is a tough situation, as we have previously discussed. I've already told you what I think would be best: write a sincere, understanding email that reiterates empowering the individual and making the best decisions for themselves. You can't control the situation at all, but at least you can bring up your concerns, as any true friend should do.

By  Rachel, at 7:12 PM, January 26, 2006  

This is always a tough situation. There's no easy litmus test, and saying anything has the potential to backfire on you, damaging your relationship with said person(s). In the interest of brevity, here's my proposed test:

Why is the marriage a bad idea?
--If the answer is "the marriage will be a failure", then you have no right to intervene. MYOFB.
--If the answer is "the marriage will lead to a verbal/mental abusive situation", then you may have a right to intervene gently, but intervention is unlikely to matter worth beans. MYOFB.
--If the answer is "the marital contract is being entered into under coercion", then you may have a right to intervene gently.
--If the answer is "the marriage is being entered into on false pretenses (i.e. he's really been unfaithful, etc.)", then you have a right to intervene, and the other party has a right to know.
--If the answer is "the marriage will set up a physically abusive situation", then you have a responsibility to intervene.

That, friends, is my metric that I made up off the top of my head.

By  Cory P., at 12:05 AM, January 27, 2006  

Also useful, use a straight-up risk-to-benefit ratio. Will the risk to your friendship be worth it for the projected outcomes?

By  Cory P., at 12:07 AM, January 27, 2006  

I think Rachel said everything I was thinking on. It depends on the situation. If your friend is getting married for the wrong reasons, not your business. If your friend is going to be in physical danger, your business.

By  Lazy Lightning, at 4:46 AM, January 27, 2006  

If you don't support the marriage, then you can express that by just not attending the wedding.

By  §, at 5:20 AM, January 27, 2006  

Generally speaking, adults are free to enter into whatever sort of relationship they find most comforting and enjoyable. Even if they find the marriage a soul-sucking wander through a Hell of self-recrimination and regret, they must have been seeking *some* comfort from the decision.

Perhaps I'm not the best source of advice, given my track record. I still believe in the idea of marriage, or at least mutually satisfactory up-shacking, but I think that it's often viewed as the only "moral" way to cohabitate, and that people who are assuredly ill-suited to one another (or to anyone, in some cases) bind their lives prematurely, setting up deeper and longer lasting angst for the future.
I say, Shack Up! After 5 years or so, if you still love the person despite their (by now readily apparent) faults, then ring it up.
Now. . . should you tell someone that they are making a mistake? Depends on how in love they are with their partner, how close they are to you, and your reasons for making your feelings known. Generally being supportive (beforehand, during the giddy hormone rush of unalloyed joy, and afterwards, during the despondent self-recriminating angst-fest of breakup) is the right thing to do.

By  DaBosDatWas, at 11:02 AM, January 27, 2006  

I'm with Rachel (and etc.)
Sometimes the bounds of propriety come second.

By  Peter, at 12:08 PM, January 27, 2006  

Thanks for your comments everyone. Let's narrow it down a bit to three situations:

1) S/he is SO wrong for you!

2) S/he is/has been unfaithful to you!

3) S/he worries me because s/he seems dangerous to your physical/mental well-being.

YES or NO to interference (on a commentary level) to each of these situations?

By  Kat, at 12:17 PM, January 27, 2006  

1.) No.
2.) Yes.
3.) Yes, depending on the severity of physical well-being.

Cory: nice flow chart, you summed up exactly what I wanted to say.

By  Rachel, at 12:34 PM, January 27, 2006  

I am going to completely fail to give you the binary answers you want, sorry ;p

1) It would depend greatly on how close you are to the person. Most people have concerns before getting married. If it is something that, based on the nature of your relationship with the person, you would normally be able to discuss with them, then go for it. At least let your misgivings be known. It can be very helpful for your confidence to know whether your friend has thought about the same things that trouble you. Of course, if you don't know the person as well, it isn't really your place to comment.

2) Probably good to let them know, but... make sure that A) the person doesn't already know and has intentionally overlooked/ forgiven the unfaithfulness, and B) be absolutely sure that you are correct that the fiancee actually has been cheating.

3) Much the same as #1 for mental well-being. In cases of physical abuse should always step in, even if you aren't an extremely close friend. Messy territory though, a direct approach isn't likely to work if the person is already putting up with this kind of treatment.

By  Eight-and-a-Half Tails, at 1:37 PM, January 27, 2006  

I would have to say another thing to consider is how well you know BOTH parties, and how sure you are of the situation/reason they shouldn't be getting married. There is nothing more hurtful to a friendship, than hearing someone you trusted tell you not to marry someone, when you know damn well that they don't know your relationship well enough to have any basis for the statement. (but of course, they think they do...and therefore won't listen to your defense.) hope that helps from another perspective.

By  emily, at 2:35 PM, January 27, 2006  

Pete: Thanks for visiting! I think I've seen your site before and I may use it in the future. Good idea, too. :-)

§: I'm not sure how effective a form of protest this is for someone in my demographic. For one, I don't know many people who follow traditional wedding etiquette. Second, as someone who doesn't have an established income, attending every wedding everywhere isn't possible anyway, especially because I'm at that age when so many of my friends are being wed in rapid sucession.

BossMan: In general, I agree with you here. In some situations, however, I might worry about a person's ability to escape a marraige (for personal reasons or external circumstances) should it fail the litmus test and things become bad.

Eight 1/2 tails: Yeah, there are some people who are prone to rational discussion about their relationships, like you and I... and some who are not. The other major point in this discussion, which I'm not even touching for reason of length is WHAT approach one should take if commenting on marraige. What works? What doesn't work?

Emi: Good point, because in most situations I doubt someone would know both parties equally well, though it is possible. I've had parents be unsupportive of a relationship, but never really friends. I'm guessing you're speaking from personal experience. What do you say to that?

By  Kat, at 3:41 PM, January 27, 2006  

Yes, Kat, I am speaking from personal experience. Well, parents' lack of support falls into a sort of understandable (to a certain degree) area...especially if you are living at home with them. They are just looking out for what they *think* is best for their baby. At a certain point though, they do need to realize that their "baby" is an adult and is going to make his/her own decisions. This whole thing makes it hard for the kid to accept the parent's opinion just because they are the parent.
As for friends, I don't have any problems there. Mainly where my above comment was coming from was with regard to family members who are peers, and think they can take the freedom to judge a relationship as a parent would. Again, they have little contact with the relationship on which to base their opinions. In those cases, I think the person should just keep their mouth shut.

By  emily, at 2:16 PM, January 30, 2006  

Yah, I think it's definitely best to give a kid enough rope to hang themselves with. That's been Justin's parents' philosophy and (more recently) mine.

I get the overall impression from everyone's responses that, outright meddling aside, there are appropriate and inappropriate instances in which to attempt to dissuade someone.

With so many people I know marrying in the recent past or future, and likely myself included, 'tis good to know what people think. Now, if only I'd asked this before RacheMicah got married. I would have tried harder instead of keeping my mouth shut! ;-)

By  Kat, at 2:28 PM, January 30, 2006  

Yeek. I weighed in on this one a touch late, but my opinion nonetheless:

1. In the situation where I thought the person was wrong for the other on a fundamental level, I would probably try to explore their reasoning for getting married. I don't think I could do too much in this situation to make a difference, but I'd at least sound things out in the event that the person picked up on any gaps just through being asked.

2. Unfaithfulness is a dealbreaker, in my opinion. If the person doesn't know about it, I would think twice about what the marriage means to them before saying something. That being said, a bridge on an unstable foundation...or somesuch. I'd probably give in and tell them unless I was sworn to uber secrecy on the matter. Been there before...*sighs*

3. Dangerous to physical and mental well being? If this person is any friend of mine, it's worthy of an intervention of sorts. Maybe not like a call them out and force them to hear my perspective kinda thing, but I've never been good at leaving that sorta thing alone. In the long run if they are that dangerous, even if the friend gets mad at you, it's worthy that you tried.

But I'm usually too opinionated. ;)

-Charles

By  Cad, at 4:47 PM, January 30, 2006  

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